by | 02, Nov 2022

Top 6 Ways Real Estate Investors Go Broke

Nobody said real estate investing was easy… in fact, we’ve always said that it’s no walk in the park. We always warn new operators of the perils of real estate investing. The risks are high… but the rewards are oh-so-sweet.

When you invest in real estate you can break the bank and win big, but all too often the bank breaks you and you end up broke.

In this week’s episode, Dan and Anthony list off the top 6 ways that real estate investors go broke. And it’s easier than you might think!

How long can you afford to bleed money? What’s the bare minimum of cash flow that you can afford in property? How well do you assess risks?

Find out on this week’s episode of Multifamily Investing Made Simple.

Tweetable Quotes:

“Insufficient cash flow I think is probably one of the top reasons a real estate investor is likely to go broke.” – Anthony Vicino

“I hate losing money. and sleep. I like money and sleep and I don’t wanna lose either.” – Dan Krueger

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five rules of investing

The Five Rules of Investing


Top 6 Ways Investors Go Broke

[00:00:00] Anthony: Is that a bad intro?

[00:00:23] Dan: No, it’s not good. It’s not bad intro. It just, that’s, it’s not the energy

[00:00:26] Anthony: you need, but here’s the thing, then that is the intro. Welcome to the episode. We’re in it. Sn i tiger. Yeah, I snuck in the side door like you thought I was gonna come in through the front door of the intro. Usual.

Um, instead, I, I, I kind of. I skirted the bouncer. I found the bus boy who was like smoking a cigarette outside the trash can in the back where he pro it up with a shoe, the door and that you’re not supposed to for this or any reason because it’s now we snuck in. We came in through the side door and welcome to the podcast.

[00:00:57] Dan: I don’t know what to do with that eye the tire energy though. Cause you brought it in [00:01:00] up here and we gotta keep it up here. And,

[00:01:03] Anthony: No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. You start hard, bring all your energy at the start in the beginning, and then we slowly fade over time until we just end on a whimper.

[00:01:12] Dan: Okay, great.

Yeah, that’s, that works for me cuz we’re gonna be talking about something that’s a little bit less than inspiring

[00:01:18] Anthony: as we get deeper on these, on this episode as we talk about these, it’s gonna be Saturn and Saturn. It’s gonna be like, Take a shot. . Yep. Get sadder. Yeah. I’m gonna be anor by the, No, it’s gonna be a good episode.

[00:01:28] Dan: Um, I don’t know about

[00:01:29] Anthony: good. But it’s gonna be an episode, hopefully insightful. Yeah,


[00:01:35] Dan: might. If you’re doing these things, you won’t feel good about yourself.

[00:01:37] Anthony: No, no. Something I, I do wanna share this though, cuz I do feel good about this. This is completely unrelated to multi-family investing. And for those listening, this is, um, a podcast about real estate where we try and spend as much time as possible not talking about real estate.

So recently, in the last week, I wanna share something, and you might find this interesting. Have I shown you this on my. this, this [00:02:00] thing on my phone is this app. Do you see this?

[00:02:03] Dan: Okay. Okay. You have words utility

[00:02:06] Anthony: predicted. So yeah, so the new this app I downloaded, it creates a new homepage on your phone and it makes your phone kind of stupid.

It like makes the app small, it gray scales, everything adds words everywhere. So it’s actually really kind of cumbersome to use and define

[00:02:23] Dan: things. So it makes your phone worse. It makes your

[00:02:26] Anthony: phone worse. Got it. Um, but in the process, so what it’s is trying to do is like break the addiction cycle. Of like always pulling up in your phone and quickly clicking on things cuz everything’s designed to be so clickable and suck you in, right?

Like, there’s brilliant people doing this to us. And so I downloaded this app and sure enough, like my, my usage time on my phone has like plummeted because my phone’s kind of hard to use now. And it’s really boring .

[00:02:52] Dan: And so, hey, just get a, just get a flip phone. I mean, if you really wanna double down

[00:02:55] Anthony: on that, but I still wanna have the smart features, like if I need them, but I You need to be [00:03:00] intentional about wanting to use them.

Yeah. Like you, you have to kind of work to get to the, the, the addiction stuff.

[00:03:06] Dan: I don’t have that as an option to me because I have an Apple product and I can’t download those types of third party apps that modify them. Really?

[00:03:13] Anthony: Yeah. What does it feel like to pretty much be a citizen of. , Uh, a dictatorship.

Expensive. Yep. That feels right. Yeah. It’s

[00:03:24] Dan: expensive.

[00:03:25] Anthony: Do you feel dirty ever? I mean, just kind of reconcile it.

[00:03:28] Dan: I’ve been, I’ve been, I’ve been in this ecosystem for, since 2009 probably. You’ve been so, You’re so deep now. It’s, it’s, it’s what I know. It’s the people’s

[00:03:36] Anthony: republic of Apple. It is what it

[00:03:38] Dan: is. It’s a great product.

[00:03:41] Anthony: spoken like a true Kool-Aid drinker. All right. Bad investing advice of the week. Here’s my take on it. Don’t, um, buy Apple cause uh, you’re gonna be sucked in forever. Isn’t

[00:03:54] Dan: that like good advice from your perspective though? So I

[00:03:57] Anthony: wrong do buy Apple. There it is. I don’t know how to do the [00:04:00] bad investing advice.

I just default invert it on the front end and then flip it. That invert always and then flip. Do you remember that? That’s, um, that’s a phrase that Charlie Monger likes to say all the time when he’s talking about mental models. One of his favorite mental models is Invert always in. .

[00:04:14] Dan: Yeah. Yeah. I like it.

Mm-hmm. , I mean, it makes a lot of sense.

[00:04:17] Anthony: I’ve never seen longer do a handstand. Oh, that’s true. Never seen an inversion out of that man .

[00:04:23] Dan: But it’s a good way to look at things like you’ve used the example a lot, you know, like if you’re trying to figure out how to like have a good marriage or, or whatever, you know, a good question to ask is like, what would I do to have a really horrible marriage and then do all the opposite things to have a great one?

Easy. It’s. Little mental exercise is a good way of looking at it. It’s completely unrelated to my bad vesty tip of the week. Which is what? Which is sit in cash and wait. Cause ,

[00:04:47] Anthony: I just imagined you in a pile of cash.

[00:04:49] Dan: Cause yeah, I’m like, uh, Squee mc duck, like swimming in my pool of gold coins right now because interest rates are high, stocks are down, we’re either entering [00:05:00] or are already in a recession.

Everything’s horrible. Uh, sit and cash and wait. And the reason I’m bringing this one up is because I’ve heard this, this concern echoed, uh, from investors for, you know, the better part of the last year, which is like, yeah. You know, um, we’re uncertain about the economy at the moment, so we’re just gonna kind of wait and see what happens, right?

This is a very common feeling that people have when we enter this type of, of, uh, section of, of the market cycle. But in reality, This is probably the best time to be allocating resources when people are concerned, when people are worried, when things are down, when things are rocky. That is when the greats are allocating capital and actually acquiring things, and when things are going amazing and you’re trying to dump more money into do coin or whatever, that’s realistic when you need to be selling.

So I guess tying it back to the whole inversion thing, most people out there need to be inverting how they are thinking and how they’re [00:06:00] behav. Based on market cycles, cuz most people are doing things the complete opposite way that they ought to be doing them.

[00:06:05] Anthony: Mm-hmm. . Um, I did a video recently where I talked about how unknowingly and unintentionally a lot of the wealth that I’ve, I’ve generated in my life came as a result of things that I did, um, coming out of the last recession in 2011, 2012.

And a lot of that was the fact that I graduated college in like 2006 or seven. So that’s like young and. Not burned at all by the recession. LA like the financial crisis did not hit my life at all. And so by the time that I started taking money seriously and started playing the game, like I wasn’t burned or gun shy.

And so like nothing held me back from jumping in, like full born being like, Yeah, let’s do this thing. Not knowing that we’re gonna be on like a 15 year, like 12 year run of, of a bull market. And that really helped me in a lot of ways. Cause I think people who did get burned were still gun shy and not getting back into the market in 2011 and 12 when.

There’s actually a lot of opportunity to be had.

[00:06:58] Dan: Yeah. I think generally doing like the [00:07:00] opposite of what the average person does with respect to managing money and in a, you know, the macroeconomic, uh, environment generally speak, people ought to be doing the opposite of what they’re doing. Mm-hmm. , their natural inclinations are probably the inverse of what is most financially prudent.

[00:07:19] Anthony: So what are your thoughts on meta? This is a timely conversation because over the last. Meta has just taken a,

[00:07:28] Dan: a dump. A dump. They, I’ve been paying very little attention. Uh, it’s kind very fascinating to me. I haven’t seen it, I haven’t experienced it. I’ve heard people just shitting on it. Um, other than that, I, I have really no insight into what the hell those they’re doing over there.

Um, the feedback I’ve been hearing from people who seem to be paying attention is this is just a product of, uh, you know, the, all the money that’s been available and like the inefficient use of resources, and it’s just kind of like, this is. Productive to anybody, Like it’s just a bunch of resources dumped into this thing That kind of sucks, [00:08:00] but again, I haven’t seen it, so I, I can’t really speak on it.

[00:08:02] Anthony: Yeah, it’s, I find it really interesting because this, this in my mind is a little bit of like the irrationality of markets. It feels a little bit like that, and I know there’s really smart people on both sides of the aisle that have opinions on it. And from a, from a high level, like where we’re at right now, the stock price on meta is like equal to where it was in 2000.

So like seven years of growth just kind of like evaporated. And it’s interesting because there are like these underlying questions about the business fundamentals, what’s happening in terms of like their missed quarterly earnings, zucks going real, real hard into Oculus and the Metaverse and all that stuff.

And they’re being a lot of people saying like, this is not the way. But the other side of it is it’s really hard to bet against. , a company like Facebook with their size, their resources, and the vision that Zucks been right, Right. Like he, he, he built this thing once that he’s been nobody else really. He money was

[00:08:59] Dan: free.[00:09:00]

Well, now money’s not free and you gotta actually be efficient. That’s, I think that’s the, Yeah,

[00:09:05] Anthony: but I mean, right. In the sense of like, he started Facebook in mid late two thousands, right? In the last recession coming out of it. Not a lot of money, but he was right about like, But he was right about where consumer behavior was going.

Yeah. Right. And so my sense is like, okay, it goes back to the Adam Newman question that we had on a previous podcast where we talked about when do you not bet on the. Like if the operator has a past track record of success. Yeah, you could say like, Money’s been free for, Facebook’s gone though. So what’s that?

[00:09:34] Dan: Carol’s gone. Who’s Carol

[00:09:36] Anthony: Sandberg? Who’s, Oh,

[00:09:39] Dan: so I mean, I mean Z’s, so who’s the real brain visionary? But like, she was the one that like made the thing good. Uh, she’s not there

[00:09:46] Anthony: anymore, so that’s fair. I mean, that’s, Operators changed. That’s a fair, it’s a fair rebuttal. So, I don’t know. I look at it, I’m just like, I don’t know.

I, it’s, I, I obviously don’t know the situation as well as, um, others do, [00:10:00] but it’s a fascinating case study that I think in 10 years we’re gonna look back and 50% of people are gonna be like, I was so right. And 50% are gonna look back and be like, I was

[00:10:08] Dan: so wrong. I don’t know if you noticed, but, uh, Elon officially took over, uh, Twitter this week.

I did. I did. So I’d be really curious to see what he does with that thing versus what Zucks doing in, in, in his sphere. Feel like, I’ll tell you what he did, What I, what I’ve been hearing, people are anticipating based on just like literally no data, just like the entity that he used to acquire the thing.

People are kind of assuming that he is gonna take like, um, uh, like a WeChat, uh, approach with it and take Twitter to something that’s a little bit more like, like WeChat as opposed. Twitter and I mean, that would encompassing

[00:10:44] Anthony: thing. I mean, WeChat is what, one of the largest social networks. I, I don’t even consider it a social network.

It’s, it’s weird to me. It’s like everything, it’s just texting. It’s, it is very confusing to me. But, um, but I’ll tell you what Elon did. So Elon, in his first day in office, he had a very big busy day. He fired the CEO a [00:11:00] bunch of VPs. He like just cleared house. And then this man abuses his newfound powers and controlling Twitter to slide into my dms.

And I was like, Dude, I don’t follow you. You don’t follow me. We’re not friends. Like stop abusing you. Don’t ask on Twitter, honey. Stop abusing your

[00:11:16] Dan: power suit. I follow like five people and he’s one of ’em.

[00:11:18] Anthony: Yeah. He’s spamming

[00:11:19] Dan: me. Spamming me now. What’s he trying to get you

[00:11:21] Anthony: to do? He’s got this new venture to, to go to Mars.

It’s crazy. I don’t know. He’s like, Hey, we’re looking for some funding. I don’t know. Wants me to raise? Sounds like a. Sounds not legit. . So

[00:11:34] Dan: the first day in office, he just starts raising capital through dms. Yeah, that’s

[00:11:38] Anthony: hilarious. That’s his game plan the whole time. I love Musk. No. Do you, do you know Jason Cal Canis?

Yeah. Okay, so Jason Cal Canis. For the listeners who don’t know, he’s um, an angel investor. Very brilliant guy. We did one of his

[00:11:49] Dan: books, right? We did

[00:11:50] Anthony: Angel. Yeah. Angel is one of his books. He’s got a podcast called All In. He’s got another

[00:11:54] Dan: Do you watch that now? Cause I was talking about that a couple months ago.

You’re like, I’ve never

[00:11:57] Anthony: listened to it still, but I listened to his other one, which is this [00:12:00] week in startups and listen to that one. Yeah, I hear all in is very good though. Um, it’s great. But Jason, you know, all those text messages from Elon and, and Twitter and everything that, that came out in the, the litigation over the last month.

Mm-hmm. . So you can go read it. It’s really fascinating. And Jason Cal Canis isn’t there and Elon’s like, Hey stop. Like, cuz Jason started raising a syndicate to fund like the takeover and Jason was like bringing the power to the people and getting them involved in this takeover cuz he like buys into the vision of.

And he wants like, stop. You’re making me look desperate. . . That’s hilarious. Jason’s like, Jason’s a cool dude, but he’s kind of sy of Fantic in that. He’s like, Oh no, bro. I didn’t mean it like that. I’m so sorry. Like, people are behind you. We believe in the cause. Like just trying to help. Sorry, I won’t step in.

Jason’s just like, Man, who’s the alpha in this room? . Oh

[00:12:45] Dan: man. I like, I like Musk. He’s, he’s funny and awkward, but I like,

[00:12:48] Anthony: I like watching brilliant, crazy people do brilliant crazy things, so he just gives like no F’s. I. Nope. He’s giving me no s just, well, actually slid into my dms. He’s trying. All [00:13:00] right.

Let’s segue.

[00:13:01] Dan: Let’s

[00:13:01] Anthony: do it. Let’s talk about real estate. Let’s talk about six reasons why a real estate investor is likely to go broke. Number one, you spent all your money about Twitter. What’s your number two?

Can we get a real number one? What do you got? Okay, Number one is, uh, fishing. What

[00:13:18] Dan: is $4 billion? Good Lord, Who, and I’ll just talk about how much she spent on.

[00:13:23] Anthony: So was a lot, a lot of money. Yeah. Um, that might be a good, if you, you anyway, um, insufficient cash flow I think is probably one of the top reasons a real estate investor is likely to go broke.

They get into an asset that is either very thin on cash flow or non-existent cash flow. It could be a development deal, it could be a heavy reno, it could be something like that. And they think that they’re gonna be able to reposition this within a certain period of time, maybe get new debt on there, and then get new people and it’s gonna start cash flowing and it’s gonna be.

And so they go into the deal thinking it’s okay, I’ll bleed for a bit. I can, I can afford to bleed for six months, and I’ll just kind of come out of pocket. It’ll be fine. And then something happens. Plan [00:14:00] doesn’t go to to, to plan. And suddenly that little bit of bleeding turns into a whole lot of bleeding.

Oof. And now you have a money pit that you can’t really get away from. You have no solution, and it just slowly sucks you down. And so you have no option but just to, um, curl up in a ball and cry.

[00:14:17] Dan: So how do you fix. You buy assets? No cash flow deal. What do you, what do you do to turn that bad

[00:14:23] Anthony: boy around?

Man, that’s a good question. So I think it’s not to say that like buying a deal that has no cash flow or low cash flow is like dubious because it’s just different risk profiles, right? Yeah. You know, it’s a different business model. Just recognize, I think, um, if you’re going in, it’s about being really, really well capitalized.

Mm-hmm. and, and, and like being prepared for winter. But our preference is just to go into assets. Our cash flow. Yeah. Like look for cash flow from day one. And that’s, that’s cuz. A lazy, scaredy, cats and, um, to be b um, don’t, don’t wanna lose any sleep at night. So we

[00:14:59] Dan: [00:15:00] hate losing money. and sleep. I like money and sleep and I don’t wanna lose either.

And I think a lot of people do. Kinda look at like a deal and say, Okay, I can, I can overpay for this deal because it’s a great deal. And yeah, maybe that means because the, the debt surface is so high because the purchase price is inflated. That Yeah. Year one is, is kind of light on cash flow, but I’m gonna get those rents up right.

And their whole business model is predicated on making some, some leaps and bounds in the income and like, what if that doesn’t happen? Mm-hmm. . Right? What if your, your, you know, cash flow break even on a good day for more than a year? What if it’s two years? You know, what if you bought something mid 20 19, 20 20 happened and all of a sudden your few months of, of light cash flow turns into a year and a half, Right?

It’s risky. And I have to agree. That’s probably one of the major reasons that people go broke. Mm-hmm. in this. My number one, or just the first thing on my list is, uh, they don’t have a team. They’re new and they pick up a property and they think, Okay, I’m, I’ll just figure [00:16:00] it out once I own the thing. Uh, but they don’t have the team in place to do all the things, the, all those things being, uh, the management, the leasing, the lender, the insurance agent.

If they don’t have all these rock stars, they’re probably gonna overpay for everything. Killing the cash flow and probably killing the deal too. So my, uh, first thing on my list is they don’t have the team in place needed to actually execute on the deal.

[00:16:23] Anthony: I can get behind that. Um, my number two is, Maybe you cut some corners, Maybe you didn’t get the right insurance.

Maybe, um, you did something improper. You didn’t follow the law to the letter, and now you got a tenant suing you. Now you got an investor suing. Now you got the city suing you. You’ll lose your building because they sued the pants off of you because not it is, you cannot go to court and use the defense that I did not know.

as a, as a, uh, as a good defense. [00:17:00] Yeah. I mean, you can use it, but it’s not gonna protect you. . Mm-hmm. . So I would say litigation is probably another reason, and this is like when you talk to people generally who don’t know real estate, I think this is one of the things that they’re most afraid of. In grand scheme, I think this is actually a very low risk, like a low probability event.

If you have the correct insurance, if you’re actually doing the things that you’re supposed to, you’re gonna get sued at some point, but the chances of it probably suing, suing you into oblivion probably.

[00:17:26] Dan: Yeah. Or not zero. I think it’s, uh, this is especially important for people that are gonna take on that management, uh, body of work themselves and, and not have a third party do.

Obviously we’re big fans of, of doing that in house because it helps keep the cost down and makes more money for our investors and helps us control that, that resident experience, uh, for residents, which is, you know, what really drives everything. But with that comes a big liability, right? You can’t just go in there and start willy-nilly, sign leases doing things, um, cuz.

Every, every area around the [00:18:00] country is gonna be a little bit different on what you’re allowed to do, what you’re not allowed to do, what you need to document. And if you don’t get all your ducks in a row, it’s inevitable. Like Anthony said, you are going to get sued at some point. Uh, but if you don’t have your proper documentation and if you’ve been doing things incorrectly, you’re not gonna have a leg to stand on.

And even though getting a, you know, a lawsuit, It’s not entirely, I wouldn’t say it’s unlikely, but given enough deals, given enough properties, at some point someone’s gonna sue you. Yeah. And you don’t want that to be your undoing. And if you don’t have your stuff documented and you’re done for your duck, your ducks in a row, it could be a, a major hit to you.

Uh, but if you do all those things, it, you’ll be good. So just make sure you or someone on your team knows what the hell they’re supposed to be doing, so you do it the right way. If you don’t, you’re. My number two in no particular order is, uh, insufficient capital. And hopefully this isn’t one of yours. I feel like it’s an ob obvious one, but insufficient reserves, infinite, insufficient, [00:19:00] uh, CapEx, uh, uh, budget from when you were doing your underwriting.

Like there’s a lot of people that I feel like get into deals and keep the capital needed to get into the deal as small as possible to maximize those returns for their investors on. Because the amount of money that the deal produces is gonna be fairly fixed. And the the, the more you can minimize the amount of capital needed to get in the deal, the more you’re gonna see your cash on cash increase, your irr.

All the return metrics go up when the denominator goes down. So it could be tempting to say, How little capital can I get into this deal with to make it. And he could make great money doing that, but the risk profile gets much bigger and you wanna make sure that you have sufficient capital. So we would much rather, and this is, you know, core to our philosophy, much rather come in very heavily capitalized deals and say, Okay, our IRR is gonna be, you know, 17% on this instead of 20.

Where it could have been if we had come in with less capital. But at least we know no matter what happens, we’re gonna be [00:20:00] okay. We’re not gonna run.

[00:20:01] Anthony: Yeah, this was actually another one on my list. I, I was gonna skip over it though, because it ties into cash flow. Like if you don’t have enough cash flow, you better have enough reserves.

Right. And if you’re skimping on both of those, well you’re, you’re screwed. You’re screwed. Like there’s no salvaging a deal that has low cash flow in insufficient reserves. You’re, you’re done. You’re done. Yeah. It’s gambling. Yeah. You’re done before you even got started, so don’t do that. Um, but I do have a third one here, um, which is that your debt runs out.

Damn it, right? Yeah. It’s, it’s a huge one, right? Like you paired the wrong debt with the wrong deal. Your debt rain due at the wrong moment in the cycle and. You’re not getting the, the numbers that you need on a, on a refinance. Maybe nobody’s giving it, or maybe they’re giving it at a evaluation that you just can’t justify.

Um, whatever reason, the bank’s coming and saying, like, loans do, and you’re caught with your pants now. Now this. . This happened a lot in 2007, 2008. This the, the impetus for the financial [00:21:00] crisis in the single family market, where suddenly a lot of houses were underwater in terms of the valuation. The banks came back and said, Hey, we need you to make this hole because you’re, you’re in, you know, technical default here.

And a lot of people lost their homes. Not even realizing that that was a thing that could ever. So it’s not even that the term runs up, right? It’s just that some covenants were, were violated, were breached inside the, the, the loan docs. And, and the thing that always troubles me with banks is that those docs are pretty, uh, bank friendly and pretty dense.

And so there’s, there’s probably some hidden language in there. About loopholes and things where the bank, if they really at the 11th hour need to bone somebody, they can bone somebody. Yeah.

[00:21:43] Dan: Keep it on those covenants and just have your lawyer look at ’em. Cuz that’s a, that, that’s a, a noteworthy one.

Mm-hmm. because sometimes there could be some stuff in there and, and my number three was the, the same D thing, limited S. But I was gonna take a little bit different plan and say, you know, short debt terms are just like restricted debt terms. But I’m just gonna skip that cuz [00:22:00] Anthony already did it and I’m gonna change my number three to.

Overly optimistic assumptions about the future. I’ve seen a lot of deals out there where people have these really, really rosy assumptions about what their rent growth is gonna be or what their expenses are gonna be. And you know, seemingly they, they think they’re gonna take something and just operate it infinitely better than whoever was operating before, which, you know, that could be possible assuming they’ve got the track record.

But sometimes you see some pretty new groups, uh, who are apparently able to operate. Amazing. Amazingly. Amazingly.

[00:22:34] Anthony: So I would say just cuz there’s a mom and pop operator doesn’t mean that they weren’t operating the thing as well as the thing could be operating,

[00:22:39] Dan: right? Yeah, yeah. Right. And I mean, you just gotta look at, at everything and take everything with a grain salt.

When you’re looking at a deal that’s presented to you, if someone’s saying they’re going to get X percent rent growth, or they’re gonna say they’re gonna decrease expenses X amount, you gotta ask Y and make sure that that makes sense. So, It’s really easy to plug in. That’s right. Uh, [00:23:00] I know, I, I get, I get a little, the clamped talking about this.

It’s, it’s very upsetting to me. But, uh, you just gotta, it’s really easy to plug in a number in a spreadsheet and say, I’m gonna raise rents X percent this year. Boom, Ir looks amazing. Like, is that really possible? Can you really do it? Maybe, maybe not really, really,

[00:23:18] Anthony: really, really? Come on. You said they come like really, really?

Yeah, that’s how we underwrite. It’s gonna be, we just said, look at each other and go really . That’s

[00:23:27] Dan: really, that’s a solid strategy right there. Ask that question. You’ll be, you’ll be in good shape. Really, Really. Okay. We’re, we’re gonna annoy

[00:23:35] Anthony: our listeners if we, uh, if they are not already, they might have tuned out.

Like they, we went deep for a while, um, before we even got to real estate talk. So they, they’re like, Yeah, I’m outta. But if you did sit around, you did listen. That’s really cool. Thank you for that. That’s neat. Um, appreciate you. Swell, swell. You’re the bees knees. I like you. Um, I don’t have a book recommendation this week.

I do have a book that I’m, uh, [00:24:00] excited to read that was recommended to me by somebody that I hold in high regard. The book is called Woodin

[00:24:06] Dan: on Leadership. I’m sorry, what was that? W Woodin on. Can

[00:24:09] Anthony: you spell that? Woodin with a w an o o d e. Woden. The, the famous fao fd. Yeah, Woden. He’s, um, said it’s strange.

He, he’s like a famous basketball coach, Woden. Oh, sports, okay. Sports, yeah. You wouldn’t get this, that’s why. But he’s a famous sports coach of a, of a game with a ball where they put in the ball, in the hoop. And, um, I’ve heard the books really good. I’ve heard it referenced many times by many, many people over the years.

So it’s sitting on my shelf at home. I’m excited to dive into it here pretty soon. , I, I mentioned this because if you’re listening to this at home and you wanna do like a little mini book club, we could do a little mini book club together. So shoot me an email and be like, I wanna read this book together at the same time.

And then what we can do is we can get together maybe every two weeks on a, on a quick call. We can get a group together and we can do ourselves a little book club. Show me an email, anthony invictus multifamily.com. I [00:25:00] don’t imagine there’ll be too many takers, but if there are

[00:25:02] Dan: Yeah, exactly. So far, every attempt at creating a book club has, uh, failed miserably.

We, so we would love it if somebody would please participate. We’re desperate.

[00:25:10] Anthony: Yeah. We make it like literally two book club sessions and then by book club session two, everybody else is like, Oh yeah, I didn’t get to read this. I didn’t get to reading like what

[00:25:20] Dan: we do. We get weird at book clubs. Like, what is it us?

Do we get weird? Period? Yeah. I mean, yeah. But really maybe it is

[00:25:26] Anthony: US. . Yeah, it’s us. Uh, it’s a hundred percent us. Um, . All right, so that’s gonna do it for us guys. If you wanna be in the book club, shoot me an email and we’ll we’ll get together with you that we’ll have. Hoot. It would be a fun time. Um, this is why no one shows up Hoot.

The Hoot . No one wants that. That’s neat. Um, love you guys. Appreciate you. If you get a chance, go leave a review. Also subscribe and uh, share it with a friend and. You can go now. We’ll see you in the next episode. Go bye bye.[00:26:00]

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